tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12471112.post6611774217315256812..comments2023-08-20T11:07:28.396+01:00Comments on Freeborn John: Repost - The unconscionable cruelty of Polly TPeter Risdonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17792275403997179926noreply@blogger.comBlogger5125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12471112.post-51133564914032528082008-04-23T11:50:00.000+01:002008-04-23T11:50:00.000+01:00Well, I don't think it's just welfare spending or ...Well, I don't think it's <I>just</I> welfare spending or state interference either. As a matter of fact, I think that without any help there'd be significant, though different, problems.<BR/><BR/>But it isn't going to be alleviated by more spending and interference alone, and these things do contribute. The focus for people in this non-working class has become not doing something for themselves but rather their relationship with the state and this lack of self-responsibility also translates into the kind of neglect I wrote about.<BR/><BR/>We need to avoid both this sort of dependency, and also the Hogarthian squalor that preceded it. Under present circumstances, the dependency is the immediate issue, surely?Peter Risdonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17792275403997179926noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12471112.post-34228460088531901002008-04-23T11:34:00.000+01:002008-04-23T11:34:00.000+01:00A very good post. I don't agree with all your conc...A very good post. I don't agree with all your conclusions, but I agree that antisocial behaviour can't simply be explained away as a by-product of poverty or inequality.<BR/><BR/>I don't think it can be explained away as a by-product of welfare spending or state interference either, though - Victorian Britain wasn't exactly crime free, surely ?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12471112.post-43794741958328006382008-04-22T14:10:00.000+01:002008-04-22T14:10:00.000+01:00I got here from a link at Bob from Brockley's blog...I got here from a link at Bob from Brockley's blog. I enjoyed the post a lot.<BR/><BR/>Rightwingprof, here in NYC all sorts of people--East Asians, South Asians, Africans, and many other groups--are moving into areas where there is a "culture of resentment, anger, and entitlement". But rather than reflect this attitude, they focus on education and success. In the rhetoric of the radical left, they have "sold out." I just think they were lucky to have good parents.<BR/><BR/>Unfortunately, the "culture" you refer to is deeper than being resentful or feeling entitled. I'm not sure what you teach or if you are even a prof. but there is an anti-learning (to say nothing of anti-intellectual) tendency among certain elements of the lumpenproletariat. <BR/><BR/>The question is why?<BR/><BR/>Like John, I don't think this can be reduced to structural factors (although poverty does suck and there is nothing cool about it). Nor do I think that any particular ethnic/racial/national group is predisposed to a certain sort of behavior. Rather, a lot of this has to do with basic parenting. Who is raising an individual child, a loving parent or is the responsibility falling on the institutions of the state?<BR/><BR/>I grew up poor on the east side of Los Angeles (1970s). Not in the projects poor but welfare poor, food stamps poor. But my mom, with two kids to raise on her own took the time to read to us, take us to the library (remember those?) and do all the things that we just expected good parents to do back in the day. <BR/><BR/>Our neighborhood was poor but safe, very mixed in terms of peoples backgrounds. I had white, black, Cuban, Mexican, and Chinese friends. I had Jewish, Catholic, Protestant and Buddhist friends. And to the best of my knowledge, my friends parents were doing the same sorts of things my mom was as far as reading to them, encouraging them to learn, that sort of thing.<BR/><BR/>So what happened? What happened in our communities? Rather than examining the "culture", broadly construed, we need to examine what's happening in our families. Because there has always been negativity out there. There has always been drugs and gangs and all this garbage. But what was different was the attitude, motivation and actions of our parents and grandparents.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12471112.post-34511362892806783052008-04-21T19:02:00.000+01:002008-04-21T19:02:00.000+01:00I'm not an immigration hawk, but one of the bigges...I'm not an immigration hawk, but one of the biggest problems with immigration here -- from somewhere other than Mexico, take note -- is that immigrants move to the inner city, and too often absorb the culture of resentment, anger, and entitlement there. The result is rising crime -- see DC and Detroit. You don't see this when groups settle in areas without this culture: The best example is Asian immigrants (meaning East Asian here). I exclude Mexicans because they don't necessarily settle in large cities, but all over the US.rightwingprofhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12419372059353408855noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12471112.post-47431538910350631532008-04-21T18:24:00.000+01:002008-04-21T18:24:00.000+01:00Well said.Well said.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com